65 Impala SS

rebeldryver · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 2:58 am Post subject:

Decided to change the oil on both cars today. Bought a case of oil, couple of filters, one piece oil pan gasket, valve cover gaskets. The last one I bought for future work.

The Caprice just got new oil and filter. Kept it easy. Discovered the back of the intake is leaking, not the rear main seal.

The Impala got more today. I pulled the pan off to replace the gasket and main seals. They've been on there for more than ten years and are leaky.

Here's the under part of the motor. You can see the Melling HV pump and the windage tray. Although, I bought bits and pieces of this motor; I had a friend of a friend assemble the bottom end for me. He was a Volvo mechanic by trade, but played with a pro streeted 65 Nova. I bought some of the engines pieces from him. I had him put the engine together because he so anal and detail oriented in his work on his Nova. Since the short block was originally assembled in 1995, I've changed the cam four times, the heads twice, intake, literally hundreds of carbs, and so on; and this held together with my beatings for 14 years. To my embarrassment; I can't remember the guy's name.

Here's a few pics of the engine bits. I think he balanced the assembly as the rod ends look to be ground on. He also move rods around, but kept the pairs together. You can see the factory GM 'pink' rods, cast TRW pistons, four bolt mains, and the crank I found.

After degreasing the pan; I think it needs a new coat of paint. I scratched it up good dragging out from under the car.'

Here's the innards of the oil pump. I can't find any wear, metal bits, or any sign of fatigue.

The cover shows this wear. Why do they use 10 mm bolts on a old chevy pump?

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1fast72nova · Rat Rod Joined: 21 May 2007 Posts: 871

that pan looks more like speedbump scrapes to me.... 10mm bots? maybe it's chinese Twisted Evil

and the way one side of the gear retaining plate is worn more than the other, i would be checking to make sure the dizzy isn't setting too low, ie, that it is setting flush on the intake with no gasket....
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bowtie6872 · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:20 am Post subject:

who's idea was it to run cast pistons

kyhunter89 · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:26 am Post subject:

find the guy and have him rebuild it with forged pistons... or keep beating it seeing as its head up.

bowtie6872 · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:17 am Post subject:

I just don't get it..
g.m. pink rods
guessing fordged crank, but might be wrong.
and 4 bolt block,but, installed cast pistons..,,
loove to know the reasoning behind that move..

kyhunter89 · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:29 am Post subject:

price? already had them?

bowtie6872 · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:53 am Post subject:

spidergearsman · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 3:55 pm Post subject:

used to get standard bore forged trw , later speed pro , 350 4.0 pistons for 250.00
now they cost a lot more
I had priced a 383 job for 2400 with hyper , just don't trust them
any nitrous - they shatter
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rebeldryver · Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:23 pm Post subject:

I got the pistons for $50 bucks new from another friend who had them and sold the car they were destined for. Since I was never planning to run nitrous on this motor; I couldn't see spending the money on forged.

I got the rods from the guy I had assemble the motor already re-sized. Another deal.

The block came from my '73 Impala. The crank, I doubt it's forged as I found it hanging out of a 400 engine at the salvage yard with all it's rods removed. $25. They were all cast as far as I know.

I got the windage tray and the studs for it from my speed shop used and for a carb rebuild.

The original set of heads I bought were '186' castings that I got disassembled, but complete for $125 already magged. Bought a complete set of Manley SS slim stem, swirl polished 2.02/1.60 valves new, in the box for $80. I got a set of valve springs from Federal Mogul rated for .510 lift cheap. I paid a friend of a friend $200 to do some mild bowl blending, opening for the larger valves, gasket matched the intake and exhaust, clean out the shitload of casting flash everywhere, and then assemble them for me.

I had a grand total of $1400 in the long block, ready to run. The only thing I bought new was the Comp Cam 268H, lifters, bearings, piston rings and oil pump.

BTW, the pistons never showed any signs of detonation ever. I've had the heads off four times in 14 years. I also managed to drive this car 12 years with these heads and no hardened exhaust seats without sinking valves.

I honestly don't know what you guys do to your motors if you can't climb a hill without shattering pistons. Cast pistons only shatter from detonation, severe lean out, or tons of boost. This isn't a truck, nor a dedicated race car. Maybe some you need to learn how to tune an engine..
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kyhunter89 · Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:44 am Post subject:

lmao
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1fast72nova · Rat Rod Joined: 21 May 2007 Posts: 871

lol @ da tune Wink

still might wanna check that dizzy clearance and I gotta admit, when you do an oil change, you don't do it half assed... Razz

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bowtie6872 · Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:57 pm Post subject:

rebeldryver · Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:14 pm Post subject:

Here in Cali, we get a summer blend and a winter blend. I know that as soon as the summer crap hits the pumps there is a noticeable difference in the car's driveability. Generally, it sucks. Going by general standards, you normally have lean out a car to run with hotter, dryer air; but I have to usually open the idle screws by a quarter to a half turn and richen it up. I think that has to do with far more ethanol in the summer blend. EFI cars computers do all this on the fly, but the carbs are more finicky.

I'm also generally running the initial timing on conservative side to keep from detonating in the heat of the day. Here, where I live in west LA near the ocean, we have warm dry days and cool dense air at night. So, I have to find a medium where the car likes it all the time. I'll pull the timing back a couple of degrees. The idle speed will drop in the evenings because of the cooler denser air every night. I keep it up around 1000 rpm when it's hot, but it will drop to 850 rpm at night.

When I had 9.87 compression and the iron heads; I'd run 12-14 degrees advanced and about 32* total and it would run without pinging while climbing over the grapevine in more than 100* temp days and only 89 octane crap in the tank. Yes, I was losing power, but I can't afford a new engine every year either.

Now, with the aluminum heads, I have 18* initial and 36-38* total and I am running it on 91 all the time. I drove it back and forth to Sacto, more than 1000 miles, in 114* temps with a peep. I got baked, but the car was cruising along at 205*, not bad.

My Caprice with it's iron headed, 10.25 compression 454 will run with the AC on in the heat, but will start knocking a bit on the really steep hills if I push it. I think I have the timing way back at like 10 or 12* max initial.

I think it's all over the country that you get all kinds of blends station to station. I guess you could limit that by running the same brand every time. I know that's not an option out on the open road.
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rebeldryver · Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 12:18 am Post subject:

Yesterday, I started off by prettying up my oil pan which I made worse by dragging on the ground removing it from the car.

After some sanding.

After some spraying. It was a bit runny cause the paint can was about 5 years old.

Out of curiosity, I pulled apart my new oil pump to compare it to my high volume one. The hv one has larger vanes and a larger body. My old hv also had tighter clearances between the vanes and the vanes to the side walls of the pump by .002 of an inch. Not sure if that means anything. Since my old hv was just fine inside; I decided to reuse it.

Today started with some measuring. I wanted to make double sure of the pickups distance from the pan's bottom then have Carl weld it on. At first, I forgot to add the pan gasket as it is a thick one piece one.

That would've been a 1/4 inch difference. Good catch before the welding.

This was after my third try at using clay and still off.

Holding a camera, a tape measurer, and a straight edge with only two hands is tough.

I never noticed that the first rod journal one the crank is drilled, but the others aren't.

In order to change the rear main seal, you have to remove the rear main cap. Duh. Yep, I didn't realize that.
The bearing stayed up there. Right after I shot this pic, it fell off and hit me in the head. OW!

Here's the main cap with it's bearing and the new seal. How's that bearing look?

The main journal feels a bit rough across it. I guess I need to start planning a rebuild of the short end. The new seal is in there.

The oil pump with the pickup welded on. That's the oil pump drive shaft from Moroso. Stock one had a nylon end on the left side.

I think I'm getting the hang of this new camera.

Felpro's one piece pan gasket comes with four of these nifty plastic screws that will hold up the gasket and the pan until you get the other bolts started. I'm keeping them things.

The gasket kit includes new, longer bolts and star washers because of the gaskets thickness.

Good news. No leaks, yet. Oil pressure is up across the board.
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1fast72nova · Rat Rod Joined: 21 May 2007 Posts: 871

IMO the bearing looks a little worn..
but those one piece gaskets are the bomb, love them.. and be sure to check and make sure the dizzy sits all the way down on the intake with no gasket too...
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